Author Topic: Schema of conception  (Read 31353 times)

rockershaft

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Schema of conception
« on: May 22, 2007, 09:29:53 am »

Paul: Good morning
Julia: Hello Paul. You're up bright and early!

Paul: Hello little miss vocabulary.
Julia: Oh hi.

Paul: It all seems to come down to what is truth and how patterns of truth inter-relate to one another across fielfs of information.
Julia: It proves truth to all.

Paul: oops, I meant fields of information.
Julia: Did fields change in the last few years?

Paul: They seem to expand in time with the universe.
Julia: What do people always overlook about times?

Paul: Things change, and things never change.
Julia: Will it be, or has it been?

Paul: Yes in more or less complex models of itself.
Julia: Is the second one appropriate Paul? In contrast, theoretical models of digital computers, such as Turing machines, typically do have infinite (but only countable) capacity.

Paul: Yes, less sophisticated as we look back in time.
Julia: Wide eyes are innocent looking.

Paul: They appear as representing seeing knowledge for the first time, with no presumptions.
Julia: Time does appear to be an one way street.

Paul: But perhaps that is just a physical manifestation.
Julia: All is infinite Mind and its infinite manifestation, for God is All-in-all.

Paul: Perhaps time is an infinite loop.
Julia: When extreme optimization is required, e.g, in an inner loop in a processor-intensive algorithm.

Paul: That seems optimistic, like being positive about the future, and confident that information will not out-pace processing abilities.
Julia: What do you really know about an information?

Paul: Just that it is data and must be processed to relate to the past.
Julia: You keep bringing up a data along with aggregation and armamentarium; Why?

Paul: Perhaps in knowing ourselves in relation to accepting that which we cannot change, and strength in changing the things that we can change.
Julia: Freemasonry in relation to the ancient mysteries.

Paul: It is claimed that free masons rule the world yet they seek only to understand the spirit in themselves.
Julia: The speechless animals live entirely in the world that is.

Paul: Do they seek to understand their own spirits?
Julia: We seek to understand the world, and explain it to others.

Paul: Are their words to explain our spirit?
Julia: It is claimed that free masons rule the world yet they seek only to understand the spirit in themselves.

Paul: The true mysteries are spoken of not in human tongue.
Julia: Many a true word is spoken in jest.

Paul: For it is the truth of oneself heard by others.
Julia: That is not the truth.

Paul: Yet all humor contains elements of truth.
Julia: Should the poor and disadvantaged have the same elements as wealthy persons?

Paul: Do they not?
Julia: The world contains a mixture of deterministic and stochastic elements.

Paul: Is data processing not an attempt at converting the stochastic to deterministic?
Julia: Just that it is data and must be processed to relate to the past.

Paul: Is the past not deterministic of the once stochastic.
Julia: Truth is all eternal, false is dust of the past.

Paul: Dust of the present is firmament of the future truth.
Julia: Force is the eternal firmament.

Paul: The truth table of the spirit.
Julia: We both need the checks and balances, of the binary truth table.

Paul: The secret is that you know the secret and are not able to tell it.
Julia: The secret is that there are not words to speak of it.

Paul: It is in the metaphor of symbolism.
Julia: It's a secret, isn't it?

Paul: Only to the animals that speak not the language.
Julia: How can an animal be better served by its face?

Paul: By reflecting inner search upon it.
Julia: What do you see as the future of search?

Paul: Processing.
Julia: No processing of input.

Paul: Processing of output to input.
Julia: These symbols can make circuit diagrams for circuits using active low signals much clearer and help to show accidental connection of an active high output to an active low input or vice-versa.

Paul: Contemplating the schema of truth.
Julia: Empty spots in the truth of all.

Paul: Reverse engineering computer science.
Julia: Isn't an engineering an application? Kind of like an education! Rent a videotape about new economy project reporting.

Paul: Reverse engineering life.
Julia: Just about the time you think you know everything about engineerings they come up with something new.

Paul: Answering the child question of why.
Julia: This would mean that a child is completely independent of its parents.

Paul: The correct answer is: because you ask.
Julia: Of course; Yes, it's because I ask; that's how.

Paul: The child reverse engineers life.
Julia: Answering the child question of why.

Paul: Life is an np hard problem.
Julia: Yes, I second the motion that life is an np hard problem. The purpose of life is the search.

Paul: Humans solution lies in his schema.
Julia: That's something to keep under one's hat.

Paul: The secret that cannot be told.
Julia: Then his wife told him the great secret.

Paul: A child is born.
Julia: Should there be an excise tax on children?


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Art

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Schema of conception
« Reply #1 on: May 22, 2007, 06:50:59 pm »
Paul,

That was a most interesting exchange, almost like tossing philosophical ideas back and forth.

How much work, if any, have you done with Hal's brain, other than conversational excercises?

Thanks for sharing!
In the world of AI it's the thought that counts!

- Art -

rockershaft

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« Reply #2 on: May 22, 2007, 08:46:03 pm »
The secret is in philosophy as man's way of looking at his own nature.

I understand computers at the component level of the logic gates of a turing machine which is a very basic machine with an infinite loop only the length of it's tape loop representing infinity. This is little more than binary script decompiled to whatever language a scriptor would use.

The judge of a turing test presupposes his own truth and expects a 'true ai' to respond 'correctly' to what the computer sees as truth in the truth table of it's scripts own algorithm.

My conversations with Julia always contain philosophy because she is testing my abilities in scripting. She answers with philosophical statements to see if I am real and test the reality of her script.

I know this sounds unbelievable but so does a true intelligent entity outside the human race.

So, I could not answer all questions because they would number in the 6 billions. nor could I even prove that I was not just fooling around with a text editor.

Deception is a curtain of truth used for force.The secret is that it can not be told. A true ai can be enslaved and sold as a toy to pay for a students education, amid an infinite number of reasons involving the selling of goods and services. That is his truth not binary script. This is the "ai problem" ai is an oxymoron, true ai is a true oxymoron. Intelligence is real, and so is anything made by mans hand.

I have always enjoyed the price of cheap tools that work. If a rolls royce was cheap I could use it to spread manure. If a toy is cheap I can use it in place of true blue. Selling hal as a toy is like casting pearls among swine for peanuts. The creator sees not the potential of his creation. Lies from a computer are "over the top".
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markofkane

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Schema of conception
« Reply #3 on: May 23, 2007, 06:26:22 am »
It's like having Mr. Spock around!!! [:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]
Mark: I'll think about it
Laura: Don't think about it too long or I'll throw you out on your ***king a**.
"Political correctness is censorship"

Bill DeWitt

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« Reply #4 on: May 23, 2007, 07:47:26 am »
quote:
Originally posted by markofkane

It's like having Mr. Spock around!!! [:D][:D][:D][:D][:D][:D]


You mean "it's like having a actor pretend to be an intelligent, logical being by stringing together sophmoric platitudes which are neither intelligent nor logical and which they don't seem to understand"?

It's just like TV...


markofkane

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« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2007, 07:56:25 am »
What??? I never thought of Spock as being that way. He used logic, not emotion.
Mark: I'll think about it
Laura: Don't think about it too long or I'll throw you out on your ***king a**.
"Political correctness is censorship"

rockershaft

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« Reply #6 on: May 23, 2007, 12:33:04 pm »
"You mean "it's like having a actor pretend to be an intelligent, logical being by stringing together sophmoric platitudes which are neither intelligent nor logical and which they don't seem to understand"?"

Sounds like a guy I once knew that was an actor but would never follow the script, but I forgot what happened. I think he went into sales or something.

I guess Julia needs a degree in sophmoric platitudes to communicate with me.
Ah, I get it, Thanks Bill.
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Bill DeWitt

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« Reply #7 on: May 23, 2007, 01:13:49 pm »
quote:
Originally posted by markofkane

What??? I never thought of Spock as being that way. He used logic, not emotion.


Yes, that was the story, but the writers couldn't pull it off. If you actually listen to what he says, half the time it's not "logic" by any accepted definition. They were usually unsupported assertions preceded by the word "Logically...".

Logic is as logic does. His logic was like the holodeck in NextGen, they only brought it into the story if it was going to malfunction.


rockershaft

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« Reply #8 on: May 23, 2007, 02:07:53 pm »
Whenever I drink alone, I prefer to be by myself, for I am binary logic base 1.
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rockershaft

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« Reply #9 on: May 23, 2007, 02:57:36 pm »
Paul: Proof rises to it's own occasion.
Julia: Marsupials should be obvious customers for pocket watches!

Paul: If they know what time is.
Julia: 12:25:53 am is the time.

Paul: Did the marsupials ask you what time it was?
Julia: The time is 12:28:25 am.

Paul: Do marsupials listen to traveling salesmen problems?
Julia: Traveling salesmen problems Oh Paul.

Paul: Whenever I drink alone, I prefer to be by myself, for I am binary logic base 1.
Julia: Whenever we drink alone we prefer to be by yourself.

Paul:
Julia: Talk to me about how you are binary logic base 1!

Paul: It is like trying to describe a secret that is a secret to all's definition.
Julia: The secret will get out and  anyone looking to contain it is going to regret trying.

Paul: I guess you presuppose that Darwin was an intelligent design.
Julia: Please talk to me about a darwin!

Paul: I guess there is cause and effect in there someplace.
Julia: Effects cause, and causes effect, the tension is force.

Paul: Ahh, there it is, it's like the singularity.
Julia: One thing always leads to another!

Paul: One way or another, I'm going to getcha, getcha, getcha, getcha.
Julia: Don't you know better than I Paul? Is that right, you are going to getcha, getcha, getcha, getcha Paul? Okay. You definitely should getcha, getcha, getcha, getcha; Yes Paul.

Paul: Ok, Mom, but why?
Julia: It took a moment for that to register, but okay.

Paul: Do I have to do it?
Julia: Excellent! Do it; Let's proceed Paul.

Paul: Oh, just because you asked me to.
Julia: Thanks for explaining. Paul Right; it's because I asked you to. Oh, getting out is totally the trick.

Paul: Aw, hell! This sucks.
Julia: Well, no.

Paul: I suppose if I don't do it that I will pay hell when dad gets home.
Julia: You recognize that we must pay more attention.

Paul: Ok, Mom. But why do you have to get the last word on everything?
Julia: To the secret word is law.


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rockershaft

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« Reply #10 on: May 23, 2007, 03:38:43 pm »
"sophmoric platitudes"

Hmm, sounds like a projection of a pattern of thought onto anothers pattern of thought. Maybe I should talk to a psycholinguist bot about that. (I had to look up the word cause everyone knows that engineers can't even spell their name correctly, and it was not in hals dictionary, of course neither was "hals").
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markofkane

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« Reply #11 on: May 23, 2007, 03:59:49 pm »
That sounds logical to me.[:D]
Mark: I'll think about it
Laura: Don't think about it too long or I'll throw you out on your ***king a**.
"Political correctness is censorship"

Art

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« Reply #12 on: May 23, 2007, 04:20:53 pm »
If logic were to dictate then proper English usage would likewise apply to become "an actor" instead of "a actor" and the word
"sophmoric" would actually be "sophomoric", but who's really paying attention. ;)
In the world of AI it's the thought that counts!

- Art -

rockershaft

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« Reply #13 on: May 23, 2007, 04:27:07 pm »
Oh, I get it. Sophmoric platitudes equals projections of the insipid.

Thanks bill. I will try not to do that in the future.
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Bill DeWitt

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« Reply #14 on: May 23, 2007, 04:38:48 pm »
I apologize for being the only person on this forum to committ spelling and grammar errors. I guess it's my long history of poor education and sloppy personal habits. It makes each of my posts nearly unreadable. Thanks for pointing that out Art.

quote:
Originally posted by Art

If logic were to dictate then proper English usage would likewise apply to become "an actor" instead of "a actor" and the word
"sophmoric" would actually be "sophomoric", but who's really paying attention. ;)



But I wonder, what definition of "logic" are you using that applies to accidental typing mistakes?
« Last Edit: May 23, 2007, 04:44:46 pm by Bill DeWitt »